How to Excel as a Milliner: Article

Muaz  

Perfect. So how did you get started as a milliner, as a hatmaker?

Elena  

Well, to be honest, everything started… unexpectedly. I didn’t decide that. I’m Russian-Israelly. So I was born in Russia. And at some point, I moved to Israel where I lived for 15 years. And at some point, I decided to come to London, studying textile design. And I enrolled into University of The Arts, London, and I studied textile design, woven textile design, and back then I thought that’s exactly what I want to do. By the time when I graduated, I understood that I was mistaken from the very beginning and the textile industry does not really give me personally the freedom that I was looking for. So it’s very much dependent on the fashion industry and on changing fashion cycles, and I needed more freedom than that. And I was looking for something that is obviously really hard to find, because Creative Industries is quite, it’s massive, and there’s so many things that you can do. And while I was searching for a job in the textile industry, I found a course for hat making, and I thought well, that’s interesting, and I can just try it. And from the moment I enrolled, and from the first day I started making hats, and I just realised that well this is it. This is exactly what I’m looking for. And with time I realised that millenary involves art, fashion, textiles, a lot of freedom for creativity, because it’s not just making hats for seasonal collections. It’s actually creating hats for events such as Royal Ascot, where you can be as creative and as crazy as you can just imagine…

Muaz  

Absolutely some of the hats look amazing.

Elena  

The crazier the better. And this is it. That’s how I found my profession. And I love it.

Muaz  

Amazing. it looks like it. So, for something like a commission, what’s your process? So how does that, I assume someone reaches out to you; and they say that they want a particular hat for a particular event? And what happens after that, so from say, I want a hat for the Royal Ascot, what would happen next?

Elena  

There are a few scenarios, sometimes the client knows what she wants. She has a vision of a particular hat, has a dress in mind, she has the shoes and accessories. And she already knows exactly what she wants for a hat… and that’s easy, because all I have to do is just to make. Others don’t really know. So the process starts from asking about what exactly they would like, what colour, what shape, what they’re wearing, what the theme might be, and then it’s starting a designing process, sketching until we find out what she might like. And after we’ve decided on the design, then I start creating. So it’s a bit of a longer process, but opens possibilities of creating something really amazing. Something that you cannot find anywhere else. Something unique.

Muaz  

Absolutely. So how long approximately does that take, so if someone wants to commission a piece, how much before the event do they need to come to you?

Elena  

Well, ideally a few months before, three-four months. Ideally, because making, the more complex the hat, the more making time I need. And sometimes it might take a month, sometimes it might take two months, sometimes it might take just a few weeks, there is much depending on design. So the sooner we start, the more time it gives me to find the right material, design the structure, and put everything together. Also a hat has to be light, strong at the same time, and very comfortable to wear. So like combining all these things together, it also involves a little bit of engineering, I would say, just to create a perfect piece that stays on their head. And it’s wearable. And it’s quite comfortable to wear as well…

Muaz  

And you can’t have pieces falling off as well.

Elena  

No… And there is a rule that once the lady wears the hat, she cannot take it off until the event is over. So imagine, the whole day the lady has to wear the hat and feel comfortable and confident wearing it.

Muaz  

I struggle with these headphones. So wearing a hat for an entire day, I can imagine would be quite a struggle. So it would have to be very comfortable and light.

Elena  

Yes, one once one of the first events that I went to, Royal Ascot. It was the first year during my college actually. I was lucky to go to the Royal Ascot wearing a hat that I designed. But back then, I mean, you always make mistakes when you’re just starting out. And I made an elastic that secures the hat, it was too tight. So basically, I was suffering the whole event and had to go to the ladies room to take the hat off, just to massage my head and put it back on. It was an absolute disaster. But that’s how you learn.

Muaz  

Absolutely.

Elena  

That’s how we learn.

Muaz  

These are important phases in getting to where you need to get to really, because you don’t really know what directions to take, I mean, your whole background, you know, from getting from textile design, to getting into hat design, required you to experiment in a number of different areas.

Elena  

That’s absolutely true. And the more experiments you make the more knowledge you get. So experimenting is very important. And the more mistakes you make, the more better you get. Yes, so you can improve your skills. So you cannot start making something, knowing from the beginning. It’s absolutely impossible. It takes a lot of time to learn.

Muaz  

Exactly, and how can you know how good you are until you keep on trying different things?

Elena  

That’s true. That’s true. And that’s what I’m saying to my students all the time. You cannot get better until you start making, experimenting and working on your skills. So the more you practice, the better you become. Nothing comes from the very first time.

Muaz  

Yeah, I mean, some of the brands that we advise as well but for us it’s more from an advertising and marketing point of view. Sometimes they say… we cannot do that…. no one else does that and I’m like, you know, sometimes you need to try things out to give you that edge, to just make you stand out. Sometimes a mistake will happen, but you will not know what you can do, or the audience you can reach until you try these things out.

Elena  

That’s absolutely true. Another thing is that mistakes can actually lead to new opportunities. Some of the mistakes can become a great hat. A great technique that you just created out of nothing, which is also very much amazing.

Muaz  

Absolutely, because we find sometimes that sometimes doing nothing is more expensive, you know, than making a mistake.

Elena  

That’s true, and sometimes when making a hat, I would make a mistake here and there and then oh my god thinking, I just spoiled the hat… I just need to start all over. Then the next day, I look at the hat then hmmm… actually that’s interesting. How did I do that… and that it creates something new and then okay, this is a wonderful thing, I’m just gonna develop this “mistake” further.

Muaz  

So what would you say are skills that would, you know, that are useful for a person in your area, skills that you have found useful as a hat designer?

Elena  

I think I would say it’s dedication, dedication to what you do. Millinery as a profession, if you don’t like any aspect of it, it will not work. So it’s either you love everything that comes with it, even negative things. As a creative business, it also involves not just making and creating, but also well, I would say more boring things such as accounting and marketing, and buying supplies, and emailing and things like that, working on the website, updating things, which takes a lot of time. And when I was studying in college, the millinery course that I was taking, I was lucky to have the best tutors ever. And one of them told us that millenary business is just 40% of creating, and 60% of everything else that has nothing to do with designing. And I thought well, we’ll see… I guess I was too ambitious back then. And when I started on my own, I realised that actually it is true. It’s absolutely true. So starting a millinery business, like any other creative business, you also have to consider that there are other things like, non related to, to designing and making. And they’re very much important as well, because without them, whatever you make, even if it’s an amazing piece, the most beautiful creation… It will never work out if people don’t see it, if people don’t buy it, if there are no clients, if you know where I’m going with that…

Muaz  

Absolutely, we deal with that every other day, when we’re working with brands, it’s a surprisingly hard sell for a creative. You’re like… but people will just find me. How exactly are they going to do that you ask? And they’re like, I don’t know, they’ll just find me. Well, you’re absolutely right.

Elena  

Yes, but they, they will not find you unless you help it a little bit. When you’re just starting, another important thing is the budget, which is also very much important. If you don’t have a budget, you have to do everything on your own. Basically, you have to learn new skills, as I had to learn like how to build a website, because in order to, to shout to the world… I’m here. You need a website, you need an Instagram page, Facebook page, and you somehow you have to maintain all of these things. And you have to make sure that Google finds your website page. Otherwise it will end up somewhere that no one… no one finds it. So when you just start, together with learning and developing millenary skills, you also have to learn many other things of how to support what you do. And if you don’t have a financial help, you just have to do it on your own. And here a very important thing is collaboration, collaborations with other artists, other designers, other professionals from different industries. And that’s how you exchange the information. That’s how you exchange the knowledge. That’s how you learn different things, how to make them happen. And the more people are involved, the better it is for me as a designer, it is better for everyone who’s involved. So I, during my career, I found that collaboration is the most important thing. That’s why I participate in different photoshoots, participate in everything that comes along, because it’s always interesting. Also, you learn about industry, and other creative industries that somehow sometimes help you develop your own designs in a way, incorporating different materials and different techniques that sometimes might surprise you how all this tools can be incorporated in hat making.

Muaz  

Actually, that’s, that’s quite interesting. So from a skill space, there’s quite a broad range of skills that an individual needs to bring on board if they don’t have the resources to get to get other people to help them out with, with those other aspects. So what would you say are useful resources?

Elena  

I found it particularly useful for me when I was just starting out. After graduating from the millenary course, which gave me a lot of skills, basic skills to begin with, I started doing work experience for other designers. And I learned a lot, a lot. Not just the skills, but the way the business works, because every designer works in a different way, with different customers. Some designers work with the bespoke hats, it means it is made by hand from scratch, other designers work with a semi bespoke techniques. So learning a little bit here a little bit there, you already have the resources to continue. Also, it’s very helpful to be in the creative environment, where you’re not just learning the skills, but you’re also communicating with other designers, learning about different events, learning about different materials, learning about not just millenary, but the creative world in general, different experience with the customers and so on, that that’s how you learn, those are the resources.

Also, of course, there are books, internet, YouTube, magazines, exhibitions, also, taking courses, not just in millenary, in other creative industries that you can use for making hats, some of the skills are also very useful. So I think I find these resources are the most important work experience with other designers. Literature, which involves books, magazines, everything, and visual learning online like YouTube, play online courses or courses in person with other designers. Because I think it doesn’t matter how skillful you are, there’s always something new, there are always new designs that are introduced, new shapes that introduced and, and there’s no stop for learning. So you always have to keep up with what’s happening actually out there. And just continue learning using new materials, 21st century introduced a lot of materials that never been used before in millinery. And these materials are amazing, but you still have to learn how to use them.

Muaz  

That’s actually quite interesting. So for these new materials… How do you… so what is your process? 

Elena  

There are few scenarios. It can come from seeing the material itself and thinking okay, how can I use it and millenary or having an inspiration from something… and then thinking okay, how can I, what materials can I use to mimic this particular object or whatever it is into hat making.So…

I’m going to tell you how I created my Autumn Winter Collection. It’s called Tenora. It came from inspiration of seeing an object, which was a streetlight, basically. Very interesting design, very modern, half of it was transparent, and half of the sphere was covered with copper colour, metallic copper. And I thought wow, this is amazing. And during the evening when the street light was lit, it was so beautiful. And it was in my area. So I was passing by every day basically looking at it. And my brain started working… okay, what can I do? What can I do? What can I do? And it reminded me okay, it looks very much like metallic foil. Okay, what can I get a metallic foil, I started searching… I found different types of metallic foil. I started experimenting on fabrics and straws, on felts and other materials for this. It was everything that I could just see in front of me. After months or two of different experiments, I came to particular results, which now is part of my collection, and part of different hats that I’ve been making. And now it is part of a workshop that I’m teaching, gold metallic foil and millinery, which is a modern approach in hat making. So how you can implement the metallic foil into your hat making, which actually looks like leather in the way if you apply it on, on felt for example. So since I don’t like working with leather, I think it’s a bit a little bit too cruel… using in millinery. So I find different ways how I can, what I can use, that looks like it, but it’s not. And that’s answering your question, thats how it happened, thats how seeing something, an object of observation, an object of inspiration, led me to the research process, and ended up in the collection that I absolutely love it. I absolutely do and everything who looks at it, like wow, this is absolutely amazing. And this is something new. So that’s how it works. On the other side, sometimes you go to the museum, you see exhibition, this is one of the most important things as well, as a designer, always open your horizons. So for example, I went to, I think it was two years ago, Saatchi gallery, there was an amazing exhibition of ceramics. And what I’ve seen, absolutely amazing shapes, absolutely amazing colours, absolutely amazing techniques, which obviously I cannot make a ceramic hat, but looking at it it started thinking, Okay, how can I make it, transferring onto millenary? 

Muaz  

So if you were to go back to the start of your career, is there something that you would do differently, based on the experience that you have now?

Elena  

Um, I don’t think I would do anything differently. I just wish I had this opportunity of learning faster. But this is not something that you can do, you learn as fast as you can. But I think I would advise to anyone to have the dedication, believing in yourself. What I notice being creative, I don’t know, eithe it’s just me personally, or it’s just creative people are more sensitive in a way. Because every hat that you make, every object that you create, anything, it’s like, it’s part of you. It’s something personal, it’s a conversation between yourself and that object that you are making. It’s a connection. And when you are finished and you take, and basically from that point, you are taking it to the world, and the world not always might like it, because you know, people are different…

Muaz  

Especially in these days of social media…

Elena  

Yeah.

Muaz  

They could say some really harsh things.

Elena  

Yeah. And even now I’m creating these YouTube videos, absolutely free because I love it; different techniques for anyone who would love to learn, especially during isolation and COVID. Everyone who sits at home, still need to learn somehow and still need to have something positive. So these little videos I’m creating for everyone who would love to learn. And sometimes someone would put a negative response, you know, like some doubt. Like why, why, just tell me why. Maybe I can change something or improve something.

Muaz  

This is such an important point, actually. So that’s, that’s something that we actively tell to people. So not only for Revstance, but it’s, it’s actually one of our key tenets, that if you want to give criticism, it has to be constructive, or you should not give it.

Elena  

Yes, that’s exactly it.

Muaz  

Otherwise you’re just putting people down. You know, especially these days, more than more than any other time, we’re all in isolation. You know, collaboration is hard as it is, but it’s harder now. So, like, literally all of the designers that we work with, and, everyone that we work with in general, we tell them that if we are going to give you criticism, it will be constructive. And also, we tell them, you know, because there have been times that we’ve been working with someone and we’ve noticed them say something to someone else. And we said we feel uncomfortable… you know, working with people who are judgmental, for the sake of being judgmental. It’s important, everyone has a point of view. And it’s important to express that point of view. But if you’re working in a creative industry, it’s important that you lift other people and that your criticism is constructive. So you’re helping the people around you improve. So I completely agree with that.

Elena  

That’s true, I have no problem with criticism, actually, I encourage it, I would love to hear the truth, even if it is positive, or negative, it doesn’t matter. But I would appreciate it to be constructive. And I appreciate it to be based on something. Because otherwise, if you say well, I don’t like it for whatever you making is, is terrible. Okay, that’s fine. That’s okay. We all have our own opinions. But just tell me why.

Muaz  

Because if you just say something is terrible, that’s meaningless, right? If you just leave it at that.

Elena  

You’re hurting my feelings, but you’re not explaining anything to me? Why you didn’t like it?

Muaz  

Absolutely. I completely agree with that. And that is something we actively challenge. You know, you’ve, you’d be surprised the number of conversations I get into where I have to remind people, if you’re going to say something, you know, I’m happy that you’re saying that you’ve got you know, that you have an opinion, but you need to back it up at something. You need to tell me why. You know, you can’t just say, you know, you don’t like this, tell me why you don’t like this.

Elena  

Yes, but that’s absolutely true. With time, I learned to ignore it. Because I understand that sometimes it’s not me, it could be something personal for the other person. But at the beginning, it was hard to accept the negativism. Absolutely based on nothing, but it was time I understand, okay, we’re all different. We have our points of view. I know it has nothing to do with me. But it took some time to get to that point. But still, sometimes it hurts. So that’s another thing that I would advise, to grow thick skin. Because being creative, you have to believe in yourself and what you do. And you also have to protect what you do. I mean, being sensitive and things like that. Whatever you’re making, if you love it, love it. And just ignore the difference of opinion. Sometimes it’s hard. But being in the creative business is always hard. Not just creative business, but it’s one of the things that I would say, just be confident in your skills.

Muaz  

Absolutely. I think if you’re entrepreneurial, you just have to just understand that a lot of people are going to say negative things. But you know, it’s just something that you need, you need to pursue because you’re going to get things wrong very often. So it’s really important that especially when you get negative feedback, if it’s not constructive that you just ignore it.

Elena  

Yes. Another thing that I would say is, it’s okay. It’s absolutely okay to reach out for help. It’s really hard to do it on your own, you cannot know everything, you cannot have all the skills. And it’s okay to admit that that, okay, I’m lacking some skills, or I don’t know how to do it. And it’s okay to reach out to other professionals or to your friends, to your family, asking for help, asking for advice, asking for just a little bit of encouragement. Because without that, it’s also hard. And obviously, you have to progress with your skills, you have to progress, with your professional skills, because you cannot always have the same skills and knowledge, you will not progress anywhere, because the world is changing even now, a few months back. And now the world is absolutely different from what we remember it less than a year ago. You have to adapt, you have to learn how to adapt and adapt quickly. So I guess that would be my advice  for everyone who’s starting out a new business, not just in military, any business, creative business, non creative business.

Muaz  

A lot of the stuff that you’ve mentioned, is very valuable, not just to people who work in, you know, in Creative Industries, but in general, and I see a lot of overlap with, with stuff that we see in our advisory and consulting business as well. And there are a lot of parallels with a lot of the advice that we give designers that that we work with, as well, you know, forming a core community is really important. If you’re in, you know, if you’re starting out and actually regardless of where you are, you know, you need to have a core community that you could talk to, you don’t need to depend on them, you know, but it needs to be some outlet for you, you need to have someone that you could have a conversation with, that kind of understands where you’re coming from. And, and that’s why finding your community is an important part of an entrepreneurship journey, I think.

Elena  

Yes. Even sometimes I call it brainstorming. Sometimes when even you talk to someone, not necessarily the person will respond when you hear your own voice. You actually might answer your own questions in a way. Just by talking, just by taking all your thoughts out, hearing your voice. And somehow brainstorming leads to something just by just sharing of your thoughts and of your ideas. So yes, I find it very much important. 

Muaz  

Well, thank you for giving us your time today. This has been a really useful session. And you know, like I said, just a lot of people will find this really valuable.

Elena  

Thank you so much. I’m happy to share.

You can find Elena online at:

• Website: https://www.elenashvab.com
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/elenashvab_millinery
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/elenashvabmillinery

You can listen to the whole interview podcast over on our podcast page or by clicking here at Being a Milliner.